Comments on Comments

I had a series of comments with Waalid that should you wish can be read HERE. I closed the comment on the post as I felt they were getting nowhere. Waalid decided to respond through another (non-Islamic related) post HERE. I thought he might respond. He hasn’t, and so I’ve no way of knowing if he read them. In response to his determination to reply I decided to turn them into a blog post. See below with my reply. BTW I am assuming English is not his first language. Please also note in the first set of comments his name is Walid and in the ones below it’s Waalid. I’ve no explanation for this.

Waalid writes:

Hi Mike,

After I showed you interisting point about trinity, I was surprise that you Disabled The COMMENTS”, on your post BBC ‘Life of Mohammed’ Observations Part 2

Dont be Afread of the TRUTH, just open your brain, We dont follow relegion because our fathers did but because our heart open for it.

In your last post before you disbled the comment you said:

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not illogical as you suggest”

I didnt comment that it was illogical but I commented about you sayin trinity is difficult to understand – incomprehensible even.

As god will be not fair If he asks people to beleive in a difficult principle, especially if you know that the first followers of prophets are not the elite but the poor and farmers that never gone to schools because they dont have an ego to stop them from following the truth.

I Travel in Africa and saw how much money the church is taking from poor people in the name of Jesus, give 10% of it to some hungry people and for the rest, go visit the castles in Vatican and you will understand that it turned in to a corporation.

I dont Accept anyone between me and My Lord, either he want to be in the middle because he wants to make money or good intention.

And when My servants ask you, [O Muhammad], concerning Me – indeed I am near. I respond to the invocation of the supplicant when he calls upon Me. So let them respond to Me [by obedience] and believe in Me that they may be [rightly] guided.

My Reply to Waalid

Hi Waalid.

Sadly Christians can do bad things. Do Muslims do bad things? BTW it was Part 1 I disabled not Part 2.

I disabled comments because it seemed that particular discussion was going nowhere because you will not accept that what the Koran says about the Trinity is incorrect – that’s my point. And since you raise it I could charge you with the same – you should not be afraid of the Truth. Would you be afraid to leave Islam and become a Christian? If you are not saying it was illogical why use the logic of 3 = 1. I’ll ask you again have you read the Athanasian Creed – I doubt it. In fact I doubt you read anything other than your own religious writing & perhaps ‘Christian’ heresies that I would happily condemn with you. I’d like you to prove me wrong. I’m not a Catholic so I agree with you on that one. That is not what we are talking about. I’ll refer you to my two options again:

There are only two options. Option 1, either Islam or Christianity is true, there can only be one. Or, option 2, neither of them is true. If it is option 2, we should all find something better to do with our lives. But if it’s option 1; we need to think about which one is true. That’s not being Islamophobic that’s being a seeker after Truth.

The Truth is only found in Jesus Christ, the only Saviour for sinners. I know that Jesus loves me and has paid the price for my sins (that doesn’t make me perfect) on the Cross and has in fact done everything necessary for my Salvation and will take me home to be with Him in Heaven. Why on earth would I want to become a Muslim with Jesus as my Saviour. Can Mohammed save anyone – no he can’t. Did Mohammed die for the sins of anyone – no he didn’t. You can’t even be sure your own (fictional) God will save you so why would any thinking person using their brain (unless deceived) even give Islam a second thought.

Jesus told the Truth when He said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6) If only you were to turn to The Lord Jesus Christ for Salvation – you would then find Him (Jesus) to be your all in all. You would know the immense blessing, and relief, of not having to work your way to heaven and you would be joining many ex Muslims that have found The TRUTH to be found Only in Jesus Christ. Will you not consider Christ? Will you not turn to Him? I pray that you will.

Do you believe the words of Jesus? if you do – turn to Him and put your faith in Him alone.

My Final Reply to Waalid

Hi again Waalid,

I just realised what an interesting post this was to leave a comment on.

Did you know that one of Augustine’s major pieces of writing was On The Trinity (De Trinitate). Augustine (354-430). You will notice this was many years before Mohammed (570-632) came on the scene!

Here is a link to Augustine The Trinity: a Summary: http://www.piney.com/Trinity.Augustine.html

and here’s another (Readable summary) link: http://thriceholy.net/Texts/augustinef.html

12 thoughts on “Comments on Comments

  1. Mike,

    I assume that you a good believer of Trinity,

    I totally agree with Walid is hard to understand Trinity. The concept itself are very hard if we read what Abraham have done (demolish idols which are polytheism) What I can see is Christian bring the polytheism back to their religion. Trinity is coming after hundreds of years after Jesus died.

    For me, understanding Buddhaism, is more straight forward, even I also do not believe it. When I read Bible, there was so many contradicted in verse by each other. When revised the KJV, NWT, even some priest also commented directly in huffingpost.com.

    I seem there was no authorization to translate Bible,
    “the process of translating words or text from one language into another:” Oxford, word translation. Where got original, all depend on faith.?

    As we all understand, Bible is coming from Aramic language, translate to Greek, translate again to Old English language, translate again to New English, and now there was a lot version of Bible. Which is tell the truth?

    Even so, who write the Bible also being discuss among priest.

    If today I say, “My brothers, this is my beloved sister, please be nice to her, do not ever touch her”
    Tomorrow become “My brother, this are my beloved sister, please be nice to her, do not ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this are my beloved sisters, please be nice to her, do not ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my beloved sisters, please be good to her, do not ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my beloved sisters, please be good to her, do ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my beloved sisters, do be good to her, do ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my be loving sisters, do be good to her, do ever touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my be loving sisters, do be good to her, do touch her”
    Next “My brother, this is my be loving sisters, do be good to her, do touch her (later)”
    Next, “My brother, this is my be loving sisters, do be good to her, later do touch her ”

    At first we may see the sentence as
    introduction of sister from a brother to a lot of “guest”,

    later end of translation
    Introduction from brother to “someone”, may be for marrying her.

    The word is seem perfect also at the end of translation in the eye of human. For me that is a Bible, a Holy Word from God, then altered by human hand. And now you all received it.

  2. Hi Hifzan,

    Thanks for dropping by.

    I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Is it some form of riddle?

    Yes, I’ve heard that argument before – and even used it myself before I became a Christian and had my eyes truly opened to the truth as it is in Jesus. I think you’ll realise that upon investigating Biblical Textual Criticism it’s a bogus and nonsensical argument. If that’s what you have been told and that’s the level of your objection you are not taking it seriously and therefore neither should I take you seriously. No one with half a brain these days believes that argument.

    You, like Waalid are not seekers after truth but have been brainwashed into believing things about the Christian faith that have no basis at all in fact. I’ve starting reading the Qu’ran and already I can see numerous references and allusions to the Bible. I mentioned this to a Muslim at work and he had no idea this was the case – he was ignorant of this. You need to start thinking for yourself and realise that without the Bible you would not even have a Qu’ran. You destroy the reliability of the Bible and you at the same time destroy the reliability of your own holy book – a book that I believe is a complete fabrication.

    Try reading Johns Gospel in the New Testament and see the beauty of the Lord Jesus Christ and read about what He did on the cross for poor lost sinners like you and me. The Bible is not, and never has been afraid of anyone critiquing it. Read it for yourself and ask God to open your eyes to the truth.

  3. Hi Mike,

    You welcome, actually that thing is riddle. From the first day Jesus received the message from God to the time you received current Bible.
    Thank you for asking.

    We both have a different fundamental in term of God. But never mind, I not going to condemn your religion, it is not an appropriate for me to condemn others people in their own house (blog). If there was discrepancies in between, God know how judge. God is Knowledgeable, He know until deep inside our heart.

    But I would like to condemn in term of lack of attitude that white man have. Ignoring other people believe, abuse power, racist, immoral sex behavior, pornography, homosexual and bad word (I see you quite polite).

    I would like to bring one quote from The great historian of the Crusades, Sir Steven Runciman, wrote that the sack of Constantinople is “unparalleled in history”.

    “For nine centuries,” he goes on, “the great city had been the capital of Christian civilisation. It was filled with works of art that had survived from ancient Greece and with the masterpieces of its own exquisite craftsmen. The Venetians, wherever they could, seized treasures and carried them off. But the Frenchmen and Flemings were filled with a lust for destruction: They rushed in a howling mob down the streets and through the houses, snatching up everything that glittered and destroying whatever they could not carry, pausing only to murder or to rape, or to break open the wine-cellars. Neither monasteries nor churches nor libraries were spared. In St Sophia itself, drunken soldiers could be seen tearing down the silken hangings and pulling the silver iconostasis to pieces, while sacred books and icons were trampled under foot. While they drank from the altar-vessels, a prostitute sang a ribald French song on the Patriarch’s throne. Nuns were ravished in their convents. Palaces and hovels alike were wrecked. Wounded women and children lay dying in the streets. For three days the ghastly scenes continued until the huge and beautiful city was a shambles. Even after order was restored, citizens were tortured to make them reveal treasures they had hidden.”

    Do you not see, your civilization is almost become as when being written in the quote. Actually it not Muslim who attack your country, your own people that being attack by your own morality.

    1. Well Hifzan,

      I am not going to defend drunkenness and the ravishing of women by anyone. There’s also no profit in exchanging atrocities – we need to get down to what it points to. What I will say however is that the Bible by way of a doctrine of ‘Original Sin’ can explain all these things you describe. Mankind can do terrible things to one another of all faiths and none.

      It’s because of sin that Jesus came into the world. People are guilty before God in their nature before they even do anything. It’s because we are sinners by nature that terrible things happen in the world and why we all do bad things. That’s why we all need a Saviour. Only Jesus can be that Saviour because He is the sinless Son of God. I hope you can at least see why Jesus has to be divine (God).

      He (Jesus) offered Himself as a sacrifice. No-one else could do that – No-one! Without a Saviour we are all lost. But thanks be to God for sending His Son into the world. I would in all seriousness Hifzan – I’m not playing games here this is serious – consider Jesus as the only true Hope for you. Whosoever shall call upon Jesus will be saved. Please think seriously about these things. As I urged you before, read the Gospel of John and read about the wonderful, precious, lovely Saviour Jesus.

      I’ll try and put a post up with links to websites where you can download and read / listen to messages that will help you and other Muslims. You will hear of the Love of The Lord Jesus Christ. The Love He has for sinners – He’s a gracious Saviour. I know this could be difficult for you. Be careful what you read on the Internet. Not everyone who calls himself a Christian is one. Satan will not want to let you go and will seek to further deceive you.

      Blessings upon you.

      1. Thank you for drop by,

        I basically read Bible only, I know OT and NT have different philosophy. But I prefer to refer words of prophet of Israel, Abraham, Moses, Isaac, John The Baptist, Ismael, Zekeriya, and Jesus sometime Jesus in Bible also said he just fulfill what Moses Law do. All this prophet are worshiping one God, but when come to Jesus he said he is Lord (from word of St John). For me it quite funny. But for that, keep to your churches to decide, I m not going to elaborate more. I prefer to follow what others prophet said.

        Talk about sinner, that thing is already happen, life should go on. Country have a big problem, Next generation are not faithful enough.Example: If I keep hope myself to be an engineer, I will not be an engineer already. We need to help our self by studying, then we will be safe. We, our self should be savior to our self. For 2000 years, Christian waiting for Jesus, how many generation have been waiting.

        We also wait for Jesus,son of Mary, but life still need to be go on. Generation need to be safe, Major sin (sex, usury, gambling, etc) need to be demolish. Faith need to be increase, Lucifer call to need to be fight, Manner need to be teach, Respecting Parent need to be learn, Worship need to be increase, Sabbath need to be respected.

        Christian & Westerner have make our self worse since all the above not been fullfil by your own people. You ask us to do what have been Liberalism do to you, ‘destroy you faith’.

        We become miserable after pornography become a major business in America and UK, kids watching porno, Sex every where.

        For me your country is no more Jesus, son of Mary, country. It become more like prophet Luth’s country.

        Why are your churches not try to stop all this, but I will blame to Atheist that call them self Christian, Your Ruler who are supporting this (not in public but silently supported), The Institution of Churches who silently fight, and Liberalism.

        For me you, yourself should start educate your own people, do not bring shame when you meet Jesus later.

        1. Hello Hifzan,

          Thanks for your reply. You rightly talk about the reality of sin in the world, but you have no solution to it other than to try and be good and educate people. You don’t seem to get why people do these things. Educate, fine. But all you end up with is educated sinners and still no solution. The only solution is for God to do something and this He has done in sending the Lord Jesus Christ. It’s good to be educated, it’s better to be right before a Holy God. That’s why I seek to point people like yourself to Christ. The Gospel means Good News. It’s not Good News to me to do more and be good – but it is Good News to me if someone has done it for me and this Jesus has done. Now that is Good News. But it’s hard because not only are we sinners but we are by nature Self Righteous sinners (the worst type of sinner actually) and so we need to come humbly before the God of the Bible and seek forgiveness purely on the basis of what Christ has done. With all this with the Lord Jesus what can Mohammed do for me – he’s dead! Jesus is alive – Praise the Lord Hallelujah!

      2. Hi Mike,
        Me again.

        1)I am not agree with you. All problem have it solution, All disease have its cure, except death. The only problem is it it remedy is for morality is faith. And I assume your morality is high. See that is solution, faith. When you have faith, you are shame to do sin, even you have natural sin.

        2) All disease have its cure, except old and death, just we not found yet. If we do not do research regarding its cure, i think Hong Kong is history already (by bird flu).

        3)So, my point is, major sin also have their own solution, it is a Law need to be study. Justice need to be hold. Morality need to be take care. People need to be educated. Current Common Law cant hold all this sin. See, the solution is in front of your eye.

        4) Talking about Law, I would like to ask you regarding law of sex before marriage, crime as thief, robbing? Christianity is a long religion and history, today, it was about 2011 years old. For that time there was no law been made?

        5) Now day, it was a modern era, we need to suit to what have been design for us. Some faithful Christian need to enter the parliamentary seat. If you just only give a seat “atheist who called Christian” than Christian will doomed.

        6) And for that ‘faithful Christian need to hold himself from bribery, money laundry, and etc. He need to fight for unmarried sex law, Usury need to demolish (how many point that in Bible said that Usury is forbidden), Thief, Tithing need to be constitute, Charity need to be promoted.

        If I become Christian, I were very ashamed to meet Jesus, may be Jesus will say.
        OK you are faithful Christian, but your neighbor not, your kid become lesser faith, your grandchild (3rd generation) become non believer.
        But may be you are safe, but your next generation is demolish.

        That what we called unlucky for others generation [Westerner are too rude, why, because, how they know what writing inside Bible, they never to go Sabbath, never meet priest]. And I think they forget who is Jesus already….

        And this Atheist is keep making problem to us already, so that why it your duty to teach them what is religion all about to your own 1st. There was no solution if own man (Christian) is win by quantity not quality.

        From quote above

        “While they drank from the altar-vessels, a prostitute sang a ribald French song on the Patriarch’s throne. Nuns were ravished in their convents. ”

        I think you understand what I mean.

        1. Hi Hifzan,

          I’m finding it difficult to follow you. But in Christ even death has a solution because He defeated it by rising from the dead. All I can say is this: The Lord Jesus Christ – He is my only hope and my Salvation. Without Christ I am lost and unless you turn to Him you will be lost. I pray you will turn to Christ the only Saviour for sinners and be saved forever.

      3. Hi Mike,

        Yes, never mind, its OK,

        Many said we are terrorist, in fact its not.

        Many said our Law (God Law) are cruel, but we try to stay out from any major sin by constitute in Law (If you study Christian Law it also cruel – many abandon it, right?) but that the thing.

        For me the diff is only definition of our God only. Other than than, most of all, we try to preserve.

        Nice blogging with you.
        If you have time come visit by blog.

        Thank You,

        1. Hi Hifzan,

          I’ve been away for a couple of days. I don’t think I can really let you get away with ‘Many said we are terrorist, in fact its not.‘ can I? I’m sorry the fact is Islamic terrorism is real. I’m not sure sure what fantasy world you live but it can’t be the same world as the rest of us live in. I’m not saying – and I can’t think of anyone that does – that all Muslims are terrorists, but at least some (Quite a few actually) are. I think you should have the honesty to at the very least acknowledge that some terrorists commit atrocities purely on the basis of their interpretation of their faith. I’m being very generous with you here Hifzan. It’s been nice blogging with you too, but If you can’t acknowledge Islamic terrorism the conversation is over.

          One more thing, the different definitions of God are worlds apart. You make it seem like a small thing. It isn’t a small difference it’s massive – the difference between life & death, truth & falsehood, darkness & light.

          BTW I appreciate you using your real name with a link to your blog – I respect that. Thanks.

      4. Dear Mike,

        All my family is Muslim, my big family also is originated Muslim, and we quite religious.From what I know, all my family never touch gun, and others weapon. And most of them are professional in their own.

        My fantasy world is called Malaysia, and it was Islam country, and actually, I worked under Chinese Christian Employer, I have 3 bosses who are Christian. My colleague is 3Chinese Buddhist, 1 India Hinduism, 2 Malay Muslim and 1 Christian and I do not see any problem with us regarding race or religion. We just respect each others.

        My working experience at site bring more other race together, Indonesian, originated India, Sri Lanka, original China, Thailand, Myanmar, local Chinese. Even they are different race from us, they still human and need to be respected, even they are poor it not doesnt mean we have a right to call them bad or terrorist. Yes, they were bad manner, but that because of the poverty (worse than poor) and lack of education.

        That why, I think European, even they are clever, but their thinking are narrow. They can not suite to other race or religion.

        Terrorism is not being teach by our religion (Islam), but I am afraid some of them (Muslim) use the name of Islam to pull their trigger. And this is wrong, and I condemn them.

        But at Palestine, I would to call them Muslim because their protecting their family from being attack by Zionist. If myself, I also can not tolerate people who coming to my home and attack my kids, my family and demolish my house. Self defend is righteous, you can not stand and wait for people to shot you. It is wrong.

        1. Dear Hifzan,

          I wasn’t for one moment suggesting you were a terrorist. If you thought that’s what I was suggesting – I apologise. I meant the wider Islamic world as you mentioned – Bin Laden etc.
          I’m all for respecting one another even if we cannot agree.

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